rene writes:
Agreeing on Heidegger is a difficult thing. Agreeing, like disagreeing is
a form of translation. But the only real translation is the one exceeding
correctness, no preceding it.
Maybe, but how are we using the word "agreement"? I don't think there is a stable or unchangeable entity called "Heidegger's truth". As if it was a matter of thinking of an object that we could all then be more or less adequate to and so more or less better representatives of Heidegger. I think what there is a faithfullness to a manner of proceeding, a style of thinking, a drift or train of thoughts that one catches and then improvises on, that one can experiments with, tinkering here and there with phrases trying to get a sense of a leap, a crossing-over from a guiding question to grouding question. It's the sharing in a kind of attitude or comportment (verhalten), a way of staying with it an a-whiling... turning a phrase in the direction of X, of the differentiation of a fouthfold that shows an immersion in the culture of Heidegger's thinking. There is nothing preventing anyone from crossing these trains of thoughts with others to come up in the end with something else. There is a faith to a tendency of thoughts certainly but one also has a responisibility to think for himself and accept the burden of standing on one's own. Finally one has to say, the hell with Heidegger! you know what I mean, I couldn't give a *fuck* about Heidegger. I talk a lot about improvicational innovation because disaster on this list would be assuming that there is something that we can all agree on as that which provides a kind of standard or measure by which then we could evaluate the correctness of a reading. I'm all with Nietzsche when he praises Emerson for being his own master by quoting Lope de Vega, "I am my own succesor". To give birth to oneself and stand without a father or the influence of a religious mother and show a sense of dignity and self-respect, this, this is NIetzsche. As Heidegger teaches us in his book on Leibniz's principle of sufficient reason the idea is never to feel the need to answer the demand to give any reasons for one's actions. I am who I am and this is what I do. For me Rene conversations are like playing in a Jazz band. First you have to tune your instrument properly and that means having a general sense of the drift of a train of lyrical thoughts, how we go from the subject to dasein (and back). I have zero doubts that this involves cultivating a stillness of the mind and not some kind of stupid running around in the head thinking about this or that. Real thinking for Heidegger is properly called meditation or pure prayer. That's how we develop an ear for each other and build a relationsip. The knots of an invisible net in Greek metis become operative when we are extremely vigilant and aware of our immidiate surroundings from day to day. It's the ancient art of the hunter, the trickster and the fox. You are way too obsessively attached to Heidegger Rene. Forget him as the end of all thinking. He is only one of many good thinkers in the history of the ideas of the world. There is lots and lots of ways. Lots of ways by which we can learn to listen to each other and so get out of the TRAP of a solipsistic navel gazing cloud of opinionated bullshit.
You are reading Heidegger well but sometimes you make and
encourage all this stupid nonsense that is no more than the expression of
subjectivistic opinions. Your discussions with Judes are sometimes and often
pure clash of wills and plague of opinions on this list. I don't feel sorry
for you in the least bit for getting caught in the trap of an operatic
buffoon whom you seem to think is more honest than he is. You are the person
the least likely to be intimidated on this list, you always have been but
your strong nature gets you into stupid and agressive subjectivitic opinions
that are not *grounded* in REAL issues on this list.
You know it better too? You KNOW what the issues are?
Yes I have a good sense for real issues that really matter and make a real difference.
I don't know what
the issues are, and insofar you, or MichaelP, or Anthony, or Jud, or
anyone say they do, i'm curious to hear, but when i press a bit, it
appears they all don't know. But they cannot admit that, so they are
in a trap. I'm curious about the mechanism at work, and i think that it
is a real issue.
I don't think Anthony showed much depth in Heidegger or being religious. MIchaelP is obviously on a path that seems authentic to me. Judy, well... she is an theatrical buffoon who lightens things for those who ahem... dont' take her so fucking seriously like you do. Like what Judy now is the truth of Heidgger? lol... holy fuck that's too funny Rene -- get real. You are starting to sound like an idiot.
Not being able to admit is, writes H in Nietzsche, the feature of all
power. So above all, Nietzsche would be its victim, the one who is our
only hope, as you say. But then we should be a lot more moderate. And
i think that that is our only chance, as a whole, but also everyone for
himself.
Yes Rene, we are getting more moderate by the minute. But seriously we should be able to have a sense of working together like in a harmonious band without feeling like we are fucking robotic followers of some fucking cult where everyone tries to be a copy of the other. Most important is being like others for sure, listening, mimicking, being a kind of mime and ventriloquist but also one goes elsewhere as is natural. You tend to be too much of the rebellious child who can't play with other kids and always has to be different. Are you a messy person like me? You must be because you are all over the fucking place and don't have the will power to stay with a topic for very long before you get thrown off course by the littlest stimulation. I'm getting thrown off course all the time but I never fail to stay the course and follow my lucky star and make the connection to my threads of thought that are running through a labyrinthian network which are constructing the Institute of Dionysian Studies which teaches people how to pay attention to the portends that usher in the innovative meandering of Persephone the new love of my life, the only love of my life ;-). I fear nothing else interests me Rene.
Here we have our first ritual murder. The victim Theo van Gogh is a
grandgrandson of the brother of Vincent, and he lost more than an ear.
The constellation of things and persons is really bizar...
Anyway, the ugly hypocrisy of those getting afraid now, while supporting
a slaughter of 100.000, is too massive to admit. A fortiori the slaughter
of the Germans, and the burning of their houses in the former century.
Rene why don't you stop reading newspapers like me? It's obviously fucking you up.
Talking to Jud (after having fallen into a similar trap you are now in)
has resulted in clearer exposure of the mechanism, and i consider those
trapped not as responsible individuals, that is: not insofar as they are
trapped.
Lol... the traps are EVERYWHERE.... Come on seriously the issue is that the trap is a kind of invisible network that amounts to nothing. Do you understand the meaning of nothing Rene? It's a kind of oscillation between being and non-being impossible to imagine or stockpile in the memory as experience and so impossible to comprehend or understand. The instruments for the forthcoming Dionysian festival of the mad ass are tuned by nothingness which quiets the mind down and gets it ready for whatever.
You are one of the
respected elders or senators on this list so I think you should try and act
more responsibly and start leading [as should peep, jan, and others...and
judes can be the clown] deeper, more serious and esoteric discussions so we
can start establishing the production of a conversational circle that we
can be proud of belonging to.
Best Wishes,
Ariosto
You're making the same point as MichaelP. But to me the esoteric and the
profund are the annoyance, if they are used to be superior.
I think I'm pretty humble. I hate being superior but I can command and I can be commanded. The point is to constantly challenge any airs of superiority. If somebody is talking bullshit and getting in the way of us learning to listen to each other and so come together as a group of unique individuals then they should be told to shut the fuck up. The ostracism of silence works. This is the ancient rule of order for a good reason. Mind you I am breakin' the rules but...
I consider this to be at the heart of the issue of the rotten race: we're
all together in this abyss, and esp. the parentless are more exposed to it
than others, and who's not without father and mostly mother too?
But philosophy or theology are not an answer to that. But why should i get
annoyed at all those lying their way out? Should i be jealous? Should i
try convince them? I rather respect their refusal of philosophy, which is
more philosphical than they (can) think, than placing myself higher, but
inevitably on the burst ground they're standing on.
Have you ever met Judy in real life Rene? How do you know she is who she says she is? From the sounds of it you are too suspicious of mp and me. Do you think we seem more superior than all others? I'm not going back like I have said several times now. Conversations in a disorganized shithole are going to come to an end. I'm the easiest person to get along with everybody who really knows me knows this. Listen to the way I think through peoples ideas and bring them together into relations with each other and if I don't care for a network of ideas then I just pass by in silence with indifference. WE are going to establish a conversational writing organization that is multicultural and multidisciplinary. WITHDRAWAL is not an option.
Notice that the by you adduced Nietzsche considered widerwille and
contempt his biggest enemies. Only contempt *out of love* is just,
and only 'amor fati' is able to see Venus' smiling in everything
that encounters.
"Who did corrupt as first the loving bonds?" As long as we carry the dog's
necklace, that came instead, everything becomes narrowed, and there's no
real breathing.
There is going to be real breathing when we decide *hard* for ORGANIZATION.
Hoelderlin was ridiculed, not only by Schiller. He published the
Night-songs, but sophisticated aesthetes missed the esoteric, i guess.
Heidegger has been scolded by all those with their finesounding names.
i remember "ruediger Hund", filthy dog. Of course they'll deny, like
our ownmost Jud now denies. But we're not going to bring to him the pleasure
of defending himself and attack his dogman.
Who gives a fuck who scolded who, and who ridiculed who, It's all shittalk Rene, shittalk of THEY-self. They said this and they said that and then he said this and they said that. Forget the fucking THEY, it's just I said this and peep said that and this goes over here and that's there and we cross here...
we are the best you old fool ;-),
tympan tzu plato
One can witness the dissection,
if one is satisfied with a good memory rather than a good philosophy.
best
rene
X - here's the envious Cerberus, cave canem.
X - (Cerberus' spot)
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